Watermark dislike and Share-Function
Posted: Saturday, August 31, 2019 10:25:01 AM
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I started a new pinterest board and since I don't like to share watermarked products. The Watermark is ugly as far as I'm concerned so I prefer not to share it.

I just opened five watermarked products in a row which I didn't want to share because of the watermark. I much prefer not to find out so late that they have watermarks. It starts to wear on me when I end up with too many in a row that I so don't like to share and as the frustration piles up I move on to skip sharing others all together.

So!
Could we have some indication of a watermarked preview on the overview pages so I spare myself the frustration of opening those I will not share in the end because of the watermark.


for listening.


EDIT:
I settle for a faint gray line underneath the preview indicating the watermark.
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Posted: Saturday, August 31, 2019 10:28:57 AM
I'm not very impressed by watermarks either. They mar even the best of designs.
Posted: Saturday, August 31, 2019 10:44:23 AM
I'm having much the same experience. I understand why people are doing it, but it definitely discourages me from promoting otherwise great works.

Now that I'm starting to do more on Pinterest, I'm becoming a lot more conscious of the blunders designers make (like poor merchandising choices, to name just one.)
Posted: Monday, September 02, 2019 6:31:05 AM
Noted and passed along!Smile
Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 2:55:53 AM
While I understand the reluctance to show watermarked products I'd prefer that Zazzle investigate the possibility of offering non-watermarked images when a share option is loaded. Unless you haven't experienced having designs hi-jacked and modified in a unacceptable manner by OTHER designers then I argue there is a good reason for watermarks. I've had three taken, modified and posted for sale and because the shop owner evidently has a higher Z rank then I do their image trumps mine in searches.

Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 2:57:26 AM
eclecticpastime wrote:
While I understand the reluctance to show watermarked products I'd prefer that Zazzle investigate the possibility of offering non-watermarked images when a share option is loaded. Unless you haven't experienced having designs hi-jacked and modified in a unacceptable manner by OTHER designers then I argue there is a good reason for watermarks. I've had three taken, modified and posted for sale and because the shop owner evidently has a higher Z rank then I do their image trumps mine in searches.


And BTW these were not stock images, they were my creations.

Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 7:30:32 AM
If you install the Pinterest browser button and pin by clicking that button when you're on your product page, you won't get the watermarks. However, you'll need to edit your published pin to change the URL to include your referral number.

Hope that helps.
Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 11:03:22 AM
Kimberly Jones wrote:
If you install the Pinterest browser button and pin by clicking that button when you're on your product page, you won't get the watermarks. However, you'll need to edit your published pin to change the URL to include your referral number.

Hope that helps.


I know how to post watermarked products without watermark and keeping referral ID and tracking code in the link. I occasionally do it when the work impresses me enough. You can no longer edit the URL on pinned images on Pinterest. You either tweak the script or you download a small image to local drive and pin from within pinterest by uploading the image from your local drive and then you can use a link with referral ID and tracking code.
I streamlined the process somewhat with a bookmarklet to generate the link with my browser.

Code:
javascript:var trackingvar= prompt('TrackingCode:'); alert(location.href + '?rf=0000000000000000&tc=' + trackingvar);


0000000000000000 replace with your ID.

But promoting on the side I like using the share button for a fast and convenient promotion session.

Unfortunately the ratio of non watermark and watermark greatly influences if I promote or don't. So those without watermark suffer less promotion because of their neighboring designs with watermark and zazzle altogether is less promoted.

I'm not the only one who reacts that way, but even those who have the patients and stick with it and promote their quota, get less done, since opening these products and closing those with watermarks eats away time.

.
Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 12:21:44 PM
Last year over the course of one month, I filed one thousand complaints with Amazon against sellers who were using ONE of my images. I wish I was exaggerating. It was a tremendous waste of time that would have been better spent making more designs. Instead, I had to stop other people from profiting off of my work. That is why I use and will continue to use the watermark feature here. At least until Zazzle reduces the size of its magnified image preview thing by about 60 or 70%. I am not a clipart factory.

I am curious... what is it about the watermark that discourages people from sharing the products that have it?
Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 12:36:21 PM
Stargazer wrote:
Last year over the course of one month, I filed one thousand complaints with Amazon against sellers who were using ONE of my images. I wish I was exaggerating. It was a tremendous waste of time that would have been better spent making more designs. Instead, I had to stop other people from profiting off of my work. That is why I use and will continue to use the watermark feature here. At least until Zazzle reduces the size of its magnified image preview thing by about 60 or 70%. I am not a clipart factory.

I am curious... what is it about the watermark that discourages people from sharing the products that have it?


I don't mind a watermark in general. I dislike zazzles watermark. It is distracting and afaik ugly.

And I can assure you I know the pain of writing DMCAs. I wrote tens of thousands myself in the last few years and I'm not exaggerating. It is a loose loose situation under the current copyright law.

I don't fault anybody for using watermark. I simply want to avoid the waste of time and frustration that is currently inevitable when you don't want those watermarks in your promotion efforts.
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Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 2:07:12 PM
[quote=Stargazer]Last year over the course of one month, I filed one thousand complaints with Amazon against sellers who were using ONE of my images. I wish I was exaggerating. It was a tremendous waste of time that would have been better spent making more designs. Instead, I had to stop other people from profiting off of my work. That is why I use and will continue to use the watermark feature here. At least until Zazzle reduces the size of its magnified image preview thing by about 60 or 70%. I am not a clipart factory.

Stargazer, I could not have said it better!!!!!

My illustrations are original, that's why I use and will continue to use watermarks.
It may take those who promote few extra seconds to open and close an image, but that does not even come close to comparing to the amount of time it takes me to create and then upload my illustration(s).
I won't run my images unprotected just to save a promoter a few seconds, and possibly/likely cost me my copyright.

@Zazzle: I agree that Z should reduce the size of the magnified image preview, it was satisfactory before it was changed.
(FYI: Been on CP since 2002, left to come to Z in July 2008.)
Posted: Tuesday, September 03, 2019 2:32:50 PM
bequiet wrote:

My illustrations are original, that's why I use and will continue to use watermarks.
It may take those who promote few extra seconds to open and close an image, but that does not even come close to comparing to the amount of time it takes me to create and then upload my illustration(s).
I won't run my images unprotected just to save a promoter a few seconds, and possibly/likely cost me my copyright.


You do what works best for you.
AGAIN
I'm not opposed to the option to use watermark.
You use it to your hearts content.
I'm happy you have the option.
REALLY

All I want, is to know in the overview, which of the products come with watermarks with a faint gray line underneath or a faint gray "W"-icon next to the title. Some small unobtrusive indicator to save me and others the frustration and the waste of time.
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Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 8:06:39 AM
Just a note to those using watermarks: Unfortunately a small version of your art (not just the product image) is accessible to casual thieves for downloading - the watermark is not applied to it. I'm not going to provide the details of how they can get to it here in the forum - just be advised that it's quick and easy.

You won't find my work in Z's marketplace unless/until this is fixed. To be clear, I'm not suggesting anyone else do the same. I can afford to make nothing for my efforts, and since my sales have been dismal, the difference between nothing and what I was making from the marketplace wasn't much anyway.

My point is that watermarks don't really offer all that much protection to your work. But I can understand why you might think it's still worth it, to forego promotion and at least have some protection for larger versions of the product image. It's a judgment call, and one individual designers have to make for themselves.

I've also had my work stolen. Unfortunately, current law in the USA offers such insufficient protection and recourse, that trying to protect my work has become a lost cause. There may come a time when I simply stop offering my work online entirely. So please understand that I'm not wholly unsympathetic to your plight.
Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 8:23:24 AM
Fuzzy Felosarix wrote:
Just a note to those using watermarks: Unfortunately a small version of your art (not just the product image) is accessible to casual thieves for downloading - the watermark is not applied to it. I'm not going to provide the details of how they can get to it here in the forum - just be advised that it's quick and easy.

Have you alerted Zazzle to this, privately, of course?
Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 8:37:18 AM
Colorwash wrote:
Fuzzy Felosarix wrote:
Just a note to those using watermarks: Unfortunately a small version of your art (not just the product image) is accessible to casual thieves for downloading - the watermark is not applied to it. I'm not going to provide the details of how they can get to it here in the forum - just be advised that it's quick and easy.

Have you alerted Zazzle to this, privately, of course?

I don't bother trying to contact them anymore, having been ignored enough times to take the hint. They were alerted by someone else via the forum, and replied, but all they could offer by way of a solution was the watermark, which doesn't even apply to this situation. No way to know if they might be taking it seriously and working on a solution, but my impression was...not so much.
Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 9:28:41 AM
Well... while I'm new to Zazzle, I've been in the online graphics business since 2006, and I can tell you from experience that there really is no good way to combat image theft. I used to spend hours and hours filing complaints, devising programmatic schemes to make it harder for people to steal things, yadda, yadda, yadda, and finally came to the conclusion that it's just a waste of time.

Once you post something on the interwebs, people are gonna treat it like it's public domain no matter what you do. Seriously, just look at the way image searches are done now days! I mean, back in the day, an image search actually took you to the website displaying the image - now they just grab the image in isolation and present it to the user to do whatever they want with. What are you gonna do, sue Google? I mean, Getty tried, and the best they could come up with was a compromise settlement that got Google to remove the "download this image" button, so now people have to right click to steal it... not sure that helped much. Unless you've got a room full of lawyers, and the resources and willingness to sue the pants off of people for using your images like Disney does, you're not gonna stop it.

The best you can really do is to try to incorporate your signature/company name into the artwork itself, so that it cannot be removed without destroying the piece. Of course, that doesn't really work for a POD application because people probably don't want your company logo in the middle of their wedding invitation or whatever.

I'm sorry to say this, but at this point, I really think you just have to consider image theft to be part of the cost of doing business on the web. It sucks, but there it is.
Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 11:36:22 AM
ZingerBug wrote:


I'm sorry to say this, but at this point, I really think you just have to consider image theft to be part of the cost of doing business on the web. It sucks, but there it is.


This is the conclusion I have reached as well but I still don't think that relieves a POD site from putting every protection they have in their toolbox in place to make it less easy for the thieves.

Watermarks are not a great solution... this is obvious by the disclaimer that Z offers along with the watermarks that they might hinder your sales.

It shouldn't be a choice between either protection or sales... not when there are other protections they could offer such as disabling the right click, or adding a transparent layer on top of our images so that when you do right click you get a blank. The competition offers it, why can't Zazzle?

No we won't be able to stop theft of our images completely but we can slow them down.

However I agree about the watermarks being distracting and I also don't like to promote images that have them, so the OP is a good idea, a small icon marking the watermarked products would be helpful and a time saver.
Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 12:44:48 PM
Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:
ZingerBug wrote:


I'm sorry to say this, but at this point, I really think you just have to consider image theft to be part of the cost of doing business on the web. It sucks, but there it is.


It shouldn't be a choice between either protection or sales... not when there are other protections they could offer such as disabling the right click, or adding a transparent layer on top of our images so that when you do right click you get a blank. The competition offers it, why can't Zazzle?

No we won't be able to stop theft of our images completely but we can slow them down.



Agreed. Unfortunately every anti-theft measure I tried only ended up hurting me in the long run. You inevitably end up creating barriers for legitimate users, and especially in this day and age when the web is literally overflowing with stuff, the harder you make it for people, the more likely it is that they'll just go somewhere else.

BTW, I tried disabling right clicking and it didn't help at all with image theft. Didn't try overlaying a transparent image, but I can't image it would hinder anyone but the most casual of thieves. There are such easy ways around it for anyone who knows much about html.

That being said, I think those sorts of measures would be a good thing, and I would heartily support them, but I wouldn't expect them to help as much as one might hope.
Posted: Wednesday, September 04, 2019 2:39:19 PM
I agree with you all. Actually i think it would be really nice if Zazzle would alow an option to designers to make and use a personal watermark? I don't know if that's a possibility or not... but I think it would be nice. Then you could make the watermark as subtle or not subtle as you wanted and also add a bit of extra shop personalization too on another level by using your signature or personal logo...just a thoughtIdea
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