New attribution model - true or false? 5 pages: [1] 2 3 4 5
Posted: Tuesday, January 21, 2020 2:27:59 PM
Elizabeth P. wrote:

Dear Designer, Associates & Promoters!

We’ve evolved our attribution model to better reward Designers, Associates and Promoters who drive customers to Zazzle by increasing the period of time during which your referral cannot be overridden (taken over) by another referral link.

Our goal with this attribution model update is to ensure that the time and effort you spend on marketing and driving traffic to your Zazzle store and products is rewarded appropriately. We believe these new changes will be an improvement for both the Associate and Promoter Programs.

Thank you for being a valuable part of Zazzle. We greatly appreciate the time and effort you put into promoting Zazzle and we look forward to a successful 2020.

If you have any additional questions, please email us at Promoter (dot) Designer (at) Zazzle (dot) com.

Here are a few examples of how Zazzle referrals work. In the examples below, we’ve updated the duration of time that your referrals cannot get overridden (taken over) to reflect our evolved attribution model.

• If a customer (i) has not clicked on any referral links in the past week, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link to start a new session on Zazzle, and (iii) makes a purchase right away, then you earn the referral.

• If a customer (i) has not clicked on any referral links in the past week, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link to start a new session on Zazzle, (iii) leaves for period of time but comes back to Zazzle within the same week organically (i.e., not through a referral link), and (iv) makes a purchase, then you earn the referral.

• If a customer (i) has not clicked on any referral links in the past week, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link to start a new session on Zazzle, (iii) leaves for period of time but comes back to Zazzle within the same week through a different referral link, and (iv) makes a purchase, then you (the original referrer) earn the referral.

• If a customer (i) has not clicked on any referral links in the past week, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link to start a new session on Zazzle, (iii) leaves for longer than a week but comes back to Zazzle organically (not through a referral link), and (iv) makes a purchase, then you earn the referral.

• If a customer (i) has not clicked on any referral links in the past week, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link to start a new session on Zazzle, (iii) leaves for longer than a week but comes back to Zazzle through a different referral link, and (iv) makes a purchase, then you do not earn the referral.

• If a customer (i) starts their shopping session on Zazzle organically or via a referral link that is not your referral link, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link during their shopping session, and (iii) makes a purchase, then you do not earn the referral.

As a side note, if you previously noticed an increase in your Promoter referrals, but have not changed your behavior in promoting your Zazzle products, then you may see a lower frequency of referrals with this update. This is due to the fact that we found instances where we were awarding Promoters on sales that they didn’t drive themselves (sales that didn’t come from the Promoter’s marketing efforts.) The good news is that we will not be reversing the referrals that were incorrectly awarded to our Promoters – those referrals are on us and we hope you enjoyed the extra earnings.

Thank you!

Best,

The Z Team


Question:
The Referral Cookie sticks for a week - true or false?

Posted: Tuesday, January 21, 2020 3:11:51 PM
Hi RoyK_is_a_She,

Great question. The cookie length has not changed - it's still 45 days.

For example, if a customer clicks on your referral link and makes a purchase within 45 days (provided they do not click on any other referral links after a week's time since they first click your link), you would earn a referral.

Hope this helps!

Best,
Elizabeth P.
Posted: Tuesday, January 21, 2020 3:15:22 PM
Many thanks to the folks at Zazzle that decided to make this change.

Idea
Posted: Tuesday, January 21, 2020 3:23:55 PM
Elizabeth P. wrote:
Hi RoyK_is_a_She,

Great question. The cookie length has not changed - it's still 45 days.

For example, if a customer clicks on your referral link and makes a purchase within 45 days (provided they do not click on any other referral links after a week's time since they first click your link), you would earn a referral.

Hope this helps!

Best,
Elizabeth P.

Thanks, Elizabeth.

Let me rephrase the question: The cookie cannot be overwritten for a week - true or false? That's what I meant by "sticks." (Previously, it was a "short period" which was later defined as "30 minutes.")

Posted: Tuesday, January 21, 2020 5:42:16 PM
RoyK_is_a_She wrote:
Elizabeth P. wrote:
Hi RoyK_is_a_She,

Great question. The cookie length has not changed - it's still 45 days.

For example, if a customer clicks on your referral link and makes a purchase within 45 days (provided they do not click on any other referral links after a week's time since they first click your link), you would earn a referral.

Hope this helps!

Best,
Elizabeth P.

Thanks, Elizabeth.

Let me rephrase the question: The cookie cannot be overwritten for a week - true or false? That's what I meant by "sticks." (Previously, it was a "short period" which was later defined as "30 minutes.")



Hi RoyK,

Yes, you are correct. The referral will now 'stick' for a week versus the short period that it would previously.

Thanks!
Elizabeth P.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 3:56:05 AM
@Elizabeth

First of all, thank you for the changes, these make promotions much "safer" both for affiliates and self-promoters. A thought, though, regarding international domains:

For promotion and advertising purposes, it would be an important improvement, if the affiliate (included promoter) program would also work across all your domains. In other words: the cookie/ID should transfer to your local domains if a visitor coming through an affiliate chooses a different language/country on your page.

Right now, international promoting is pretty complex, if you want to avoid affiliate losses due to language/domain switches: providing on a single ad all the dozen+ links to every Z domain is not doable, so you have either to run local ads or to direct your ads first to a central place, like a website, where you redirect the potential international visitors to the appropriate and/or desired Z domain. The latter one comes with some disadvantages: the promoter must also maintain and update the intermediate site and is less flexible, and the extra stops may (will) result in potential traffic losses on Z.

Considering that online/social media promoting, especially if not done actively through ads but through blogs, IG, FB pages etc., reaches usually an international audience, it would be truly helpful for affiliates, if they wouldn't have to care about such cross-domain details.

I was also wondering: if the customer switches language on the same domain, e.g. Englisch and Spanish on com, or English and French on ca, I suppose, the cross-domain cookie loss doesn't apply in these cases and the affiliate cookie is maintained? Or have we to promote multiple languages on the same domain separately, too?

Thank you for your patience Roses
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 6:01:57 AM
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 8:38:02 AM
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?

OH GOOD question! This is most likely where I lose most of my self referred sales. Smile
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:10:40 PM
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?


Yes good question!
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:12:30 PM
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?

And vice versa.

I figure the reason they changed it is because their own rf links were being overridden. For example, a customer comes to Zazzle through a promo email but then contacts a designer for custom work and the designer does the work and sends their own rf link, overriding Zazzle's own.

Considering all of the measures they have already taken to ensure that we can't get a referral for custom work (e.g. no rf links in chat) and the verbiage from the news post, that is my assessment.
Elizabeth P. wrote:
...we found instances where we were awarding Promoters on sales that they didn’t drive themselves (sales that didn’t come from the Promoter’s marketing efforts.

The only way that makes sense to me is if designers were sending customers rf links after the customer had already landed on the site. I can't think of any other way that a promoter or affiliate could get a referral on a sale that they didn't initially drive. Either that or someone was gaming the affiliate system somehow. But then there is this entry...
Elizabeth P. wrote:
The good news is that we will not be reversing the referrals that were incorrectly awarded to our Promoters.

So, it obviously wasn't because of gaming or, they would not only be attempting to retrieve that money, they would be shutting those gamers down. And then there is this.
Elizabeth P. wrote:
If a customer (i) starts their shopping session on Zazzle organically or via a referral link that is not your referral link, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link during their shopping session, and (iii) makes a purchase, then you do not earn the referral.

The way I have read it is that this change makes rf links stronger. Zazzle has their own rf links everywhere. Considering that, this will make it way harder for anyone who isn't Zazzle to get a referral. You would need to bring in a new customer that has never heard of Zazzle to get a referral. And considering the new lifespan of Zazzle's own rf links, it will also cause 3rd party sales to greatly increase. This could eventually lead to all of our sales becoming 3rd party.

Remember not long ago when Zazzle started factoring in 3rd party sales into the royalty calculator? Designers protested because it was confusing. Perhaps that was in anticipation of this.

It also means that we will not be rewarded for doing custom work on Zazzle unless we charge the customer an outside extra fee, which is neither optimal or practical in most situations.

In my opinion, none of this is good for customers, designers or affiliates.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:12:58 PM
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?


Yup, they sure are. Same rules apply. If the customer was brought to the site by your link, a marketing email we send cannot override that either within the given timeframe. Happy
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:28:24 PM
James wrote:
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?


Yup, they sure are. Same rules apply. If the customer was brought to the site by your link, a marketing email we send cannot override that either within the given timeframe. Happy


But it works both ways now doesn't it?


Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:32:10 PM
James wrote:
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?


Yup, they sure are. Same rules apply. If the customer was brought to the site by your link, a marketing email we send cannot override that either within the given timeframe. Happy

Thanks for replying to that question. This is the first time I have seen a Zazzle employee admit that Zazzle has their own rf codes that aren't just for tracking. I mean, it's pretty obvious that is the case, but no one from Zazzle has ever confirmed it until now.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:35:21 PM
Jerry wrote:
James wrote:
Colorwash wrote:
Are Zazzle emails the customer receives during that first week included in those cookies that won't override an affiliate's cookie?


Yup, they sure are. Same rules apply. If the customer was brought to the site by your link, a marketing email we send cannot override that either within the given timeframe. Happy

Thanks for replying to that question. This is the first time I have seen a Zazzle employee admit that Zazzle has their own rf codes that aren't just for tracking. I mean, it's pretty obvious that is the case, but no one from Zazzle has ever confirmed it until now.


+1
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:37:22 PM
I would like to know why they do it and when they are going to stop.


It is not industry standard like was said once...

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 12:45:41 PM
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.

It's not really a competition when one of the contestants makes all of the rules and can change them at will.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 1:09:32 PM
Jerry wrote:
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.

It's not really a competition when one of the contestants makes all of the rules and can change them at will.


agree!
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 1:12:36 PM
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:


It is not industry standard like was said once...

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.


If this one Zazzle practice would change, I would be so happy. I'm grateful for the opportunity and platform Z gives me for my business. But this has always felt like a poke in the eye and the "partnership" feels a bit one sided.

I am very curious to see how these new developments apply to my sales.

Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 3:03:15 PM
Lynn-Marie Gildersleeve wrote:
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:


It is not industry standard like was said once...

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.


If this one Zazzle practice would change, I would be so happy. I'm grateful for the opportunity and platform Z gives me for my business. But this has always felt like a poke in the eye and the "partnership" feels a bit one sided.

I am very curious to see how these new developments apply to my sales.



+1
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 3:09:45 PM
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:
I would like to know why they do it and when they are going to stop.


It is not industry standard like was said once...

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.


@Shelli
Many years ago, 2008 and on, CP allowed their employees to have shops and affiliate. I know, because I asked an employee who I was working with on my shops. And got that answer. It wasn't common knowledge, and I was not permitted to share on their forum. They stated that any information shared between them and me was private. But if memory serves they later gave SKs the ability opt out of the affiliate program.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 3:41:17 PM
bequiet wrote:
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:
I would like to know why they do it and when they are going to stop.


It is not industry standard like was said once...

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.


@Shelli
Many years ago, 2008 and on, CP allowed their employees to have shops and affiliate. I know, because I asked an employee who I was working with on my shops. And got that answer. It wasn't common knowledge, and I was not permitted to share on their forum. They stated that any information shared between them and me was private. But if memory serves they later gave SKs the ability opt out of the affiliate program.


So that might be what they meant by industry standard: POD industry. I was thinking affiliate program industry. Thanks for sharing!
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 4:27:14 PM
🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick wrote:
bequiet wrote:
[quote=🌼Shelli Fitzpatrick]I would like to know why they do it and when they are going to stop.


It is not industry standard like was said once...

at least the other places where I have affiliated never competed with me for referrals.


So that might be what they meant by industry standard: POD industry. I was thinking affiliate program industry. Thanks for sharing!


@Shelli
To get the exact info, had to go to my "wayback machine"--my burned CD from 2005 Smile
I checked, and saw that it wasn't 2008, it was 2005.
Here it is:
Aug 31 2005 CP Affiliate Program Beta
You had to have a shop and be invited by CP.

Relying on memory: When SKs were given the option to opt out, you would not be found in the market place. Had to drive your own traffic.

I believe that during the program CP went with Commission Junction.
I recall that the affiliate program never worked correctly,lots of problems. They changed the person in charge several times. They finally dropped the program, can't remember the exact time that happened tho, ATM.

I was with CP from 2002 to 2009, but came over to Z in July 2008.
CP transients were made many promises by Z. It doesn't matter now.
Closed my CP shops in 2009.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 4:55:03 PM
bequiet wrote:

CP transients were made many promises by Z. It doesn't matter now.


Sad
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 6:05:24 PM
Elizabeth P. wrote:
Hi RoyK,

Yes, you are correct. The referral will now 'stick' for a week versus the short period that it would previously.

Thanks!
Elizabeth P.

Thank you, again, Elizabeth.

Additional questions -

- Will the Referral Cookie set by Zazzle's "associate" ID used in email links, advertising (Pinterest, Google Shopping, etc.), and elsewhere also be non over-writable for 7 days?

- Will Zazzle continue to "affiliate" for itself and compete with true affiliates in email links, advertising, and elsewhere?

- Will Zazzle's "associate" ID still have the capability to overwrite Affiliate and Designer Referral Cookies?

If all of the above are true and the statement made in THIS post are true, where the take-away is that the purpose of Zazzle's "associate" ID is to track marketing channels:
Susan wrote:
Hi everybody,

In response to the following,

Z puts their own rf number in every link in every email they send, even our sales notifications are littered with them. as long as they continue this practice the referral system is broken.

As we’ve said before, yes, Zazzle does use its own RF codes. Each of our channels (e.g. paid emails, ads, affiliates, etc.) all use different RF codes so we can better track sales and performance. Using RF codes to track different marketing channels is a part of standard analytics and measurements; it ensures that we spend money in the best ways to bring in more customers to the site.

Thank you!

Susan


- Will Zazzle change it's Referral Rate to 0%?

- Will Zazzle make it's "associate" ID immediately over-writable by true Affiliates and Designers?



Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 6:19:20 PM
I'm very much in line with your thinking, @Jerry. I just had that conversation with someone yesterday because my gut says it benefits Zazzle or the change wouldn't be taking place. I would like to be wrong.

Jerry wrote:
For example, a customer comes to Zazzle through a promo email but then contacts a designer for custom work and the designer does the work and sends their own rf link, overriding Zazzle's own.


Jerry wrote:
It also means that we will not be rewarded for doing custom work on Zazzle unless we charge the customer an outside extra fee, which is neither optimal or practical in most situations.

^This was part of that conversation. It's a push to get us out of email communications and into Chat.

Elizabeth P. wrote:
If a customer (i) starts their shopping session on Zazzle organically or via a referral link that is not your referral link, (ii) clicks on your Promoter or Associate link during their shopping session, and (iii) makes a purchase, then you do not earn the referral.

I believe this is how it currently works, if a second link is clicked within the 30-minute time frame.

BUT. If this example is true, then it should stand to reason that an in-session customer with a Referral Cookie set can't pick up a Zazzle Referral Cookie in an email from Zazzle's registration email, old order confirmation email, Zazzle ad, or anywhere else.

Jerry wrote:
The way I have read it is that this change makes rf links stronger. Zazzle has their own rf links everywhere. Considering that, this will make it way harder for anyone who isn't Zazzle to get a referral. You would need to bring in a new customer that has never heard of Zazzle to get a referral. And considering the new lifespan of Zazzle's own rf links, it will also cause 3rd party sales to greatly increase. This could eventually lead to all of our sales becoming 3rd party.

I am thinking the same and, again, hope I am wrong.
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2020 6:19:54 PM
Lynn-Marie Gildersleeve wrote:
If this one Zazzle practice would change, I would be so happy. I'm grateful for the opportunity and platform Z gives me for my business. But this has always felt like a poke in the eye and the "partnership" feels a bit one sided.

+1
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 12:21:32 AM
Our promo emails work in the same way one of your associate links do though. If we bring the traffic to the website, why would someone else reap the rewards? Same as if one of your links brings a cst to pillows on Monday, signs up for newsletter on Tuesday; gets a promo email Wednesday to revisit and bring them back. Thats within a week right? So you still get the referral as you initially brought them to us. Seems pretty fair to me. Believe it or not, this model was altered with designers in mind. Love
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 12:49:30 AM
James wrote:
Our promo emails work in the same way one of your associate links do though. If we bring the traffic to the website, why would someone else reap the rewards? Same as if one of your links brings a cst to pillows on Monday, signs up for newsletter on Tuesday; gets a promo email Wednesday to revisit and bring them back. Thats within a week right? So you still get the referral as you initially brought them to us. Seems pretty fair to me. Believe it or not, this model was altered with designers in mind. Love


When one of those email links does overwrite an associate referral id Zazzle not only reaps the referral that the original link would have gotten but also counts themselves as a third party sale and reaps the referral carve out from the royalty of the designer of the product. How is this fair?

Whether the window of time is 30 minutes or 7 days why does Zazzle affiliate for themselves and call themselves a third party?

Already Zazzle reaps the sales and lion’s share of the profits. But that isn’t enough?
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 1:03:53 AM
James wrote:
Our promo emails work in the same way one of your associate links do though. If we bring the traffic to the website, why would someone else reap the rewards? Same as if one of your links brings a cst to pillows on Monday, signs up for newsletter on Tuesday; gets a promo email Wednesday to revisit and bring them back. Thats within a week right? So you still get the referral as you initially brought them to us. Seems pretty fair to me. Believe it or not, this model was altered with designers in mind. Love

That's called advertising. A normal company pays for their own advertising, since it's their own products that are being sold. Those emails are not for blank zazzle products, but beautiful designed by artists whom zazzle doesn't pay for their designs. And the productdesigns zazzle uses in their emails, in their banners... they don't pay the designers for that either , they just use them for free. on top of that, Zazzle makes designer pay a refferal fee to Zazzle for selling Zazzle's own products. Designers already also pay Zazzle for being on Zazzle's site when they sell a product through the markup.

At least be honest about that zazzle is their own affliate by putting this on the affliate program page.
Because the way it is now, somebody brings a customer to zazzle, and zazzle tries to do everyting they can to get that referral. When a customer signs up, zazzle has the email address, not the affliate. When a customer wants to buy something but has a question (which in many cases now first goes to designers who pay zazzle to do ALL the customwork)... zazzle puts their own aflliatenr in the email for the customer to click to read the answer. When a customer puts items in their shoppingbasket but doesn't pay for them straight away... zazzle sends them an email with their own refferalcode.


Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 1:16:49 AM
If someone is already on Zazzle, how would they gain a referral link from anyone else? Clicking on a product from the MP doesn't trigger a referral. If the visitor is organic, there is no referral attributed, unless they leave the site, find a referral link and come back(unlikely). It's all about how the customer gets to the website. Who bring them to Zazzle. You don't get a referral for having items on the MP. You get them for bringing traffic to the MP, old or new. I'm sorry you guys are only seeing the negative of this. I'm far from an affiliate master, and still finding my feet with understanding it all, but it seems like your chances of keeping a referral (instead of it being overwritten) have sky rocketed. Happy
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