Hidden - a really d***b idea
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 1:06:14 PM
I reacted to another campaign on social media and didn't realize that I promoted quite a few hidden products. Now I'm unhiding as much as I can and instead of promoting my items, I*m stuck with unhiding my stuff. Thank you very much!!! >Sad

I want bulk unhiding!

Because guess what. One of the hidden was one of the successful collecting likes in the social media only the like on the social media site and run into 404 if they do visit zazzle.

Dumb idea!!! You block my resources! >Sad
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 1:23:43 PM
vivendulies wrote:
I reacted to another campaign on social media and didn't realize that I promoted quite a few hidden products. Now I'm unhiding as much as I can and instead of promoting my items, I*m stuck with unhiding my stuff. Thank you very much!!! >Sad

I want bulk unhiding!

Because guess what. One of the hidden was one of the successful collecting likes in the social media only the like on the social media site and run into 404 if they do visit zazzle.

Dumb idea!!! You block my resources! >Sad


There is a Visibility dropdown where you can choose to view all hidden and then you should be able to unhide them in bulk but they will probably just be hidden again until you make some sort of info change.

Also, based on what I have read here in the forums, clicking a link which leads to a hidden product brings up an error page with links to your store I believe. So not all is completely lost while you work to fix things.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 1:27:18 PM
I don't like the hidden idea either,never have, direct was a better idea imo but zazzle says it will hurt SEO... And zazzle also said we were supposed to get a link back to our stores when someone clicks on a hidden item, not a 404 error, but as of yet this hasn't happened. If we have to have to things hidden, we at least need that redirect to our stores. Wish they would tell us when this will happen. Seems like that should have been in place before items actually went into hiding.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 1:38:17 PM
No you can't and you didn't get my point. There is nothing wrong with the product. It is the nature of the beast, that you have lots and lots of items that drown on the longtail of search results. With zazzles "glorious idea" too hide products you will have to unhide your items before you can advertise for them. As I said, I had success with buttons hidden on zazzle because the product image was in social media.

Zazzle hid a potential. It isn't surprising that a large number of items are "under performing" zazzle made the longtail inaccessible.

A huge number of perfectly good products are in the long tail. The incredible large number of items simply creates the so called longtail but because search algorithm are constantly shifting any longtail-item can swoop to the front.

Zazzle accelerates the problem and there is no bulk unhiding. You can select hidden but you can't bulk unhide.

Yes I'm aware that they will be hidden in 180 days again.

Zazzle chooses to place me in a gerbil wheel. Active like hell but totally ineffectively going nowhere.

Blocking my resources!

I'm busy with writing cease and desists to amazon and unhiding zazzle items.

No resources left to create and promote.

If you call a hidden item link in browser where you are not logged in you get the login mask. It is as good as 404. The product is unreachable for the lead.

So NO! the item is not unhidung if access from outside.

If you are unaware of the fact, the zazzles automated process hid the product in the meantime, your success in social media in any campaign is fruitless.

You won't be aware in all cases, that your marketing success is sabotaged by zazzles automated hiding function.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 1:42:57 PM
vivendulies wrote:
No you can't and you didn't get my point. There is nothing wrong with the product. It is the nature of the beast, that you have lots and lots of items that drown on the longtail of search results. With zazzles "glorious idea" too hide products you will have to unhide your items before you can advertise for them. As I said, I had success with buttons hidden on zazzle because the product image was in social media.

Zazzle hid a potential. It isn't surprising that a large number of items are "under performing" zazzle made the longtail inaccessible.

A huge number of perfectly good products are in the long tail. The incredible large number of items simply creates the so called longtail but because search algorithm are constantly shifting any longtail-item can swoop to the front.

Zazzle accelerates the problem and there is no bulk unhiding. You can select hidden but you can't bulk unhide.

Yes I'm aware that they will be hidden in 180 days again.

Zazzle chooses to place me in a gerbil wheel. Active like hell but totally ineffectively going nowhere.

Blocking my resources!

I'm busy with writing cease and desists to amazon and unhiding zazzle items.

No resources left to create and promote.


The 180 days has morphed into 15 months now! Smile
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 1:52:43 PM
poshandpainterly wrote:
vivendulies wrote:
No you can't and you didn't get my point. There is nothing wrong with the product. It is the nature of the beast, that you have lots and lots of items that drown on the longtail of search results. With zazzles "glorious idea" too hide products you will have to unhide your items before you can advertise for them. As I said, I had success with buttons hidden on zazzle because the product image was in social media.

Zazzle hid a potential. It isn't surprising that a large number of items are "under performing" zazzle made the longtail inaccessible.

A huge number of perfectly good products are in the long tail. The incredible large number of items simply creates the so called longtail but because search algorithm are constantly shifting any longtail-item can swoop to the front.

Zazzle accelerates the problem and there is no bulk unhiding. You can select hidden but you can't bulk unhide.

Yes I'm aware that they will be hidden in 180 days again.

Zazzle chooses to place me in a gerbil wheel. Active like hell but totally ineffectively going nowhere.

Blocking my resources!

I'm busy with writing cease and desists to amazon and unhiding zazzle items.

No resources left to create and promote.


The 180 days has morphed into 15 months now! Smile


I have 600+ items hidden. I don't care whether it is 15 month or 180 days. unless you counter with unhiding, marketing success with outside links and images are sabotaged due to inaccessibility.

I for one don't have the resources to keep track of all my items and it takes me a while to unhide those 600+ items which most are perfectly good products lost in the long tail of search results.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 2:00:47 PM
Wait...when did they remove the ability to bulk "unhide"? That sucks...
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 2:05:43 PM
Fharrynland wrote:
Wait...when did they remove the ability to bulk "unhide"? That sucks...


I don't believe they did because I was just able to bulk unhide.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 2:16:53 PM
Gina ┬ęgleem wrote:
Fharrynland wrote:
Wait...when did they remove the ability to bulk "unhide"? That sucks...


I don't believe they did because I was just able to bulk unhide.

Yeah, I just looked at it and I'm able to as well...Viven may be referring to something else...?
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 2:20:50 PM
Sorry about that, I just learned how.

I still consider the fact that I have to constantly unhide my items to __not__ sabotage my outside links and social media efforts a waste of my time which could be spent more effective with other things.

For the moment I am P*SSED that I lost several hours on potential leads who might have followed my links and only reached the login mask not the product detail page.

For the moment I am P*SSED that I am unaware that an item is hidden if I access the detail page via a shop search and might promote and pass on links to hidden items.

For the moment I'm furious that I have to spend hours unhidng 600+ products. >Sad
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 2:28:48 PM
Put it in the book, Viven...
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 2:29:06 PM
vivendulies wrote:


For the moment I'm furious that I have to spend hours unhidng 600+ products. >Sad


if it makes you feel any better, compared to me you are golden. I am not even going to state how many hidden products that I have now but I will say that it is more than 600, like way more. think the Battle of Thermopylae where your hidden products are the Spartans and mine are the Persians.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 3:03:53 PM
For the moment all my items are accessible again. With 96 per page is 600+ hidden unhide fairly manageable and "spending hours unhiding" was a little over the top.

I can now concentrate again on promotion and creating ... sigh ... But I will have to watch the hidden cr*p obviously more closely and unhide all before I campaign in the social media in order not to sabotage my efforts.

But zazzle! Cropping search results and hiding when these unreachable behind the cropped page line don't get visitors is the result of self fulfilling prophesy. You declare perfectly good yet unlucky products unfit for the marketplace & shop, when they really aren't and drive your zazzle user nuts.





Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 3:07:31 PM
Jerry wrote:
vivendulies wrote:


For the moment I'm furious that I have to spend hours unhidng 600+ products. >Sad


if it makes you feel any better, compared to me you are golden. I am not even going to state how many hidden products that I have now but I will say that it is more than 600, like way more. think the Battle of Thermopylae where your hidden products are the Spartans and mine are the Persians.


Misery seeks misery ... ?! no it doesn't. I am still royally mad.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 5:38:05 PM
Hi folks,

Some things to keep in mind here. First, please remember to abide by our forum rules. I know some are unhappy with the changes made, and we welcome constructive criticism, but anything outside of that will be removed. We want you guys to continue with your forum privileges, so please bear this in mind.

Secondly, these changes are being made to benefit the designers and customers. Hidden products have never been able to be purchased because hidden is only set so that you can see it when your logged in. I think you are referring to direct only products. Thirdly, if you ever did sell the product at all (even just once), then that product is safe. Nothing is deleted, so take this opportunity to look at the designs you have and see if it's something you can edit either with the tags, title, description, etc. Promote it more so that it can make a sale. Or remove it all together. The choice is yours. Quality over quantity.

And lastly, in case you haven't checked I've continued to update our FAQ section last week. Some of your questions and/or concerns might've already been answered there.

Thanks again all!
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 6:58:14 PM
Hi Christine,

Would it be possible to allow us a "go to page" added to the hidden products view? While working on it, or coming back to it, we have to forward page, after page, to get to where we were previously, to continue on. It would be much appreciated.

Thanks
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 7:56:32 PM
Hi Christine

I'm talking __hidden__ -- inaccessible for any one but the designer, only if logged in. Once logged in you can access hidden products via shop search and land on the detail page as if nothing is different with the product. In the shop view there is no indication that the product might be hidden, which is why I published links & images in social media of hidden products and every one who actually followed my links landed on the login page and was precluded from accessing the product.

For hours I ran with a campaign and gave zazzle a bad name for advertising false leads.

I made use of an opportunity to make my designs known and was sabotaged with your latest changes, which mislead me by failing to notify me on the detail page of the changed status of the product.

>Sad I got mad!
I little sharing of dissatisfaction and anger won't hurt.

Christine wrote:
Secondly, these changes are being made to benefit the designers and customers.

We can agree that we have a difference of opinions.

My recent experience taught me that your changes hinder my efforts, drain my resources make a difficult situation worse.

I know from experience in other print on demand services that three and four year old designs lost in the long tail get a chance if changes in the search algorithm bring them up front on a regular basis.

Your changes label these lost in the long tail products failures and hide them.

Since you crop the search result, you cut anything trapped behind page 28 off. You favor search result pages over detail pages.
This means that many times a google search result id out dated and the design found in the google search result is nowhere found on zazzle.

Since the product was in googles front results the SEO the designer put in place was successful, unfortunately zazzle sabotaged it with their search algorithm. Again two dynamic contents clashing is the nature of the beast and does not reflect on the quality / demand of the product itself.

I learned that to have any success on print on demand sites is always a numbers game. You have successful designs that drag less successful designs with them. Not so on zazzle. On zazzle the less successful get hidden.

I learned that any successful design can loose its sales position at any time with no fault to the efforts of the designer or reflecting on the quality / demand of the design. It is simply a matter of visibility and zazzle is cutting of the visibility not only on the marketplace but in the shops too.

And if opportunities present itself, products are out of stock for weeks or the automated process has them hidden and by the time the problems are fixed the opportunity is gone.

Christine wrote:
Secondly, these changes are being made to benefit the designers and customers.

We can agree that we have a difference of opinions.

I can't help it if products are out of stock. I'm stumped that it occurs so frequently. My nail art is still fairly popular and get outside links on many social media sites. Unfortunately still out of stock.

Hidden -- luckily I can do something about that, but it is draining my resources and I loose momentum.

And even if I check before I publish a link the automated process might hide my freshly advertised product and make my efforts fruitless. I might get all day long re-posts and likes on social media and the effect with incoming visitors on zazzle may very well be delayed to the point that a successful campaign lands on hidden products when these visitors finally come.

To me zazzle seems to forget that many if not most zazzle designer are one (wo)man shows struggling with resources and that between zazzle search algorithm and search engines it is the nature of the beast that a large number of designs get lost in the long tail and it is only a matter of sheer numbers and doesn't reflect quality or demand in any way.

With rare or cryptic search terms I can make any design show up but if I use common search terms my design is within a search result of tens of thousands of designs and since your system was built to flood the marketplace via quick create a lot of good designs drown in in the masses.

It is simply the nature of the beast.
Posted: Monday, May 02, 2016 10:24:54 PM
vivendulies wrote:
Jerry wrote:
vivendulies wrote:


For the moment I'm furious that I have to spend hours unhidng 600+ products. >Sad


if it makes you feel any better, compared to me you are golden. I am not even going to state how many hidden products that I have now but I will say that it is more than 600, like way more. think the Battle of Thermopylae where your hidden products are the Spartans and mine are the Persians.


Misery seeks misery ... ?! no it doesn't. I am still royally mad.


I was simply pointing out that as a community we are all in the same boat. There is no misery in my relationship with Zazzle or our community. I actually think that the APO has the potential to be a healthy system, it just creates more work for us, some of us more than others. But in the long run it could save everything. That is all I was saying. I was trying to be a supportive community member. I grasp now that my support was inconsequential. #noted

Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 12:11:14 AM
I'm in the same boat as Jerry. With over 70,000 products between all of my stores, it stands to reason that I would have thousands that have been hidden. I feel overwhelmed by it, but I think it's a good that I'm being forced to look through them and make some decisions. I've made changes to some products, but I've deleted the majority of the ones I've looked through.

Even though I see the benefits of this change, I can also understand Viven's frustration. I think she made a good point regarding the search engine and Zazzle cropping search results. It's true that many products don't have much of a chance since the search engine doesn't work properly and anything beyond page 26 will never be seen. While the APO and MPO processes are a necessary part of cleaning up the Marketplace, it may have been easier to accept had Zazzle first fixed the search engine and stopped cropping search results before implementing these processes. At least then it would seem as though all products had been given a fair shot at being seen before they were hidden.
Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 2:36:43 AM
PawsitiveDesigns wrote:
Even though I see the benefits of this change, I can also understand Viven's frustration. I think she made a good point regarding the search engine and Zazzle cropping search results. It's true that many products don't have much of a chance since the search engine doesn't work properly and anything beyond page 26 will never be seen. While the APO and MPO processes are a necessary part of cleaning up the Marketplace, it may have been easier to accept had Zazzle first fixed the search engine and stopped cropping search results before implementing these processes. At least then it would seem as though all products had been given a fair shot at being seen before they were hidden.


Were we ever given a reason why they cropped it to 26 pages of search results?

My own experience on a different pod is that some of my designs hanging around on page 80(ish) have suddenly been found and sold, by selling one copy that design jumps up the search results list, gets seen more easily and then sells a few more copies. Z have blocked any possibility of that happening

EDIT: I've started a separate thread asking this question to make sure it doesn't hijack this one!
Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 4:36:43 AM
JuJuGarden wrote:
Hi Christine,

Would it be possible to allow us a "go to page" added to the hidden products view? While working on it, or coming back to it, we have to forward page, after page, to get to where we were previously, to continue on. It would be much appreciated.

Thanks


Not sure this will help you but, if using Windows, you can right click on a product and select "open in new tab" ... when you're done editing that product, close that tab, and you're right where you left off on your hidden products list.

Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 5:59:28 AM
Christine, in the light that many of us (at least me) has to work through many thousands of products, either making them unhidden, or deleting those that gives me a chance to remove those I want to remove from the store (to replace with those I feel have a better chance), can we get the number of products displayed per page to be higher. Right now it is either 24, 48, 72 or 96. So if I am trying to delete 2000 products that I want to remove, I have to do it 96 products a time, which seems a daunting task. If I could have something such as Select All products, or even something greater than 96 (500 / 1000, etc), it would make the task of optimization much easier.
Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 8:00:30 AM
ashishagarwal74 wrote:
Christine, in the light that many of us (at least me) has to work through many thousands of products, either making them unhidden, or deleting those that gives me a chance to remove those I want to remove from the store (to replace with those I feel have a better chance), can we get the number of products displayed per page to be higher. Right now it is either 24, 48, 72 or 96. So if I am trying to delete 2000 products that I want to remove, I have to do it 96 products a time, which seems a daunting task. If I could have something such as Select All products, or even something greater than 96 (500 / 1000, etc), it would make the task of optimization much easier.


Just do a sort of 96 and look up in the address bar, change that 96 to whatever you want, I've done as many as 1000 at a time before when my internet was running fast. Give it a try, it's a time saver. Grin
Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 8:40:01 AM
Last summer I sold cards that I created in 2013, they had never had a view, but for some reason, they sold from a 3rd party. This card sat in my store for 2 years before getting a view and selling. BUT under the new merchandising terms that card would have been hidden long ago.

I am averaging 70 hidden products daily, many of them I have on my blogs and a few posters I sold during the Christmas Season (2 years ago) but because no sales were created in the last 15 months these products were hidden.

I think hiding products is a dumb thing to do, but I do not own zazzle and it is their deal, maybe they need to free up space for servers...I do not know.

Instead of tweaking the titles and descriptions with keywords I am deleting all the hidden products. I do not have time to edit every single product. What time I do have online I would prefer to design new products.

Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 10:59:04 AM
I found I had within all my stores a few thousand that were hidden. Not all had fallen beyond that 15 month period. I found many that I had placed in collection pages which are not that old. Which means those items had been viewed not that long ago.

I also unhidden many Father's Day items. Like many others, I don't think this was a good move.

Then there are items which maybe are not something people buy. Like the electronic skins. Nearly all of those items were hidden for me.

I have deleted some items. Others I think it is difficult for people to fined when they are not in the top featured pages. Does not mean they are a bad design.
Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 11:10:11 AM
Maybe this is on another discussion. But I am interested in finding out what products rarely sell on Zazzle.

Since one of my biggest hidden items were all types of skins for mobile to laptops, I am wondering how others do on those items. Or are they products that people usually don't buy.

Can we have a list of good selling items and not so good selling items?
Posted: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 11:33:19 AM
Sandyspider wrote:
Maybe this is on another discussion. But I am interested in finding out what products rarely sell on Zazzle.

Since one of my biggest hidden items were all types of skins for mobile to laptops, I am wondering how others do on those items. Or are they products that people usually don't buy.

Can we have a list of good selling items and not so good selling items?


There is a list of (of unknown accuracy) if you go to the zazzle home page and then click on the trending button. It takes you to the Trending page with recently sold items, updated from time tot time. Next to the categories at left are numbers which represent how many have been sold in an unknown amount of time (since zazzle opened? this year? this quarter?).

Looking at that you can get a sense of popularity if you also take into account how long zazzle has been selling the item and if it went out of stock for a long time and then came back in stock.

Skins don't really do too well but not the worst. The outstanding winner in Electronics is cases with iphone cases being at the top. The bottom is phone pouches and power banks. To be fair, power banks are a recent-ish item and may catch up to other items at some point. But at no point will they come near iphone cases.

The catch is that other people look at Trending too so the enormous number of iphone cases sold is matched by the equally enormous number of cases made. The skins are middling and actually do a little better than you might think.

For some reason this doesn't work for clothes. Trying to see the subcategories of trending clothes just brings you back to the home page for clothes.

The updating is sketchy. One of the "recently sold" chargers is a charger I sold last summer. On the other hand, near the top of Trending is a Mothers Day card so that bit got updated recently. The hottest sellers probably get updated the most often.

I check in with Trending from time to time to see if there is a category that I have been ignoring but that sells well.
Posted: Wednesday, May 04, 2016 7:49:43 PM
Guess I had forgotten about the trending button. Thanks for the information Susannah Keegan. This does help.

Plus I have noticed that what does not sell for me does sell for someone else.
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